Jump to content

Hi, need some help with this one...


Kimon

Recommended Posts

Hello everybody. I stumbled across one bunch of mushrooms 2-3 days before christmas. They were in a pine forest close to a lot of dead wood (but not on it), at an altitude of 1400 m. It was snowy those days, but that particular day the weather was good and the snow was melting... There were a lot of mushrooms everywhere, many of them though had been rotten away... I checked them out on my guide and on the net. I thought they were armillaria mellea, but i think there is one key difference; Armillaria mellea has ring on its stem. The ones i found dont. My second thought was that maybe they are armillaria tabescens or lentinellus cochleatus, but i aint so sure... Is it possible that sometimes mushrooms actually ARE the type they look, even without a basic detail such as the ring at the stem? Could they be armillaria mellea even without the ring? (i guess thats a newbie question, i promise to get better... :)

post-665-0-61129600-1388651936_thumb.jpg

post-665-0-95893600-1388651990_thumb.jpg

post-665-0-06446300-1388652045_thumb.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Another nice observation of mushrooms from Greece, Kimon. As I have said previously, it is likely that many of the mushrooms there are different species than what I find here in eastern North America. But this time I can be certain of one thing. These are not Armillaria mellea, or any of the other closely related Armillaria which develop a ring on the stalk. Although the ring may occasionally disappear on a couple specimens, in a cluster of Armillaria mellea at least a few will show the ring.

As for Armillaria tabescens, the gills don't look quite right, nor do the stalks. Gills on Armillaria types develop pinkish/brownish spots. The gills seen here appear to show a faint grayish tint. Also, mature A. tabescens gills tend to be decurrent (extending down the stalks). For the mushrooms being considered, the attachment of the gills to the stalk is variable, with some of them slightly notched (depression in gill width near point of attachment to stalk). Also, Armillaria stalks tend to be a bit hairy or fuzzy. The stalks seen here appear to be smooth to slightly textured with grayish streaks. Finally, the cluster of mushrooms pictured has a lot of soil attached to the base. Looks like these mushrooms are truly terrestrial, as opposed to growing from buried wood. Armillaria types all grow on wood.

Lentinellus cochleatus also grows on wood. For this type, the stalks are laterally attached to the caps. The stalks seen here are centrally attached. Also gills should be more consistently decurrent for L. cochleatus. The gills seen here have slightly irregular edges. L. cochleatus (and other Lentinellus types) have serrated gill edges. So, I doubt these are Lentinellus.

So what type mushroom do I think these are...? Often, it is easier to say what a given mushroom is not, as opposed to saying what it is! I have a few suggestions, but none of my proposals come with high confidence level. First, one genus which features species of mushrooms that occur terrestrially in clusters is Lyophyllum. Another genus is Clitocybe. Some Clitocybe species are dangerously toxic.

All of the mushroom types discussed above have white or cream spore prints. If you obtain a nice thick spore print --half on white paper, half on black paper-- and determine that the print is other than white, then perhaps we may have an entirely different discussion about these same mushrooms. To me, these look like a light-spored mushroom, likely white-spored.

Kimon, sorry I haven't been able to provide more definite proposals for your observations. IDing mushrooms from photos is tricky. But your posted photos are really good! In situ shows growth and habitat. Second photo shows clustered stalks and gill features. Third photo shows cap surface. Another web site that is mainly devoted to mushroom ID is Mushroom Observer. There are European MO members. I think your posts would attract attention and commentary on MO.

http://mushroomobserver.org/?_js=on&_new=true

I have enjoyed viewing your posts here at WM, especially since there are virtually no wild mushrooms for me to observe here in Pennsylvania at this time of year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well thanks a lot for your kind words. I was a bit concerned that 3 posts in a row from a newbie would be too much but i guess thats not the case... anyway i have tried to sign up in a greek mushroom forum last year but the administrator never answered back (the posts seem old as well now that i visited the site again...). I will check out your proposal. Thanks again Dave. You ve been really helpful.

PS i am ashamed to admit that i dont know how to make a spore print yet. I will check it on the net and give it my first try next time i go hiking...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To take a spore print, lay the mushroom cap gills/pores down onto the spore gathering medium... paper, plastic, foil. Allow he mushroom cap to remain like this for at least 12 hours. Sometimes it takes longer. Sometimes a spore print fails to develop until after several days, but this is uncommon. With a fresh mature mushroom cap, a nice spore print usually forms within a 24 hour period. If the mushroom being printed is placed in an area where air flow or other activity may cause the spores to drift way from the collection medium, then cover with an inverted cup. I think it's best to choose an area where air movement is nil and proceed without covering, since covering the cap can cause moisture to get trapped and hasten the decomposition process.

Here's a discussion lifted from this website.

http://www.wildmushroomhunting.org/index.php/topic/290-spore-prints/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, within a rather long post seen above, I did mention Lyophyllum. I think these may be L. descastes. Pure white spore print for this type... as opposed to merely light colored. Two things that bother me about proposing L. descastes are seen in the gills. First, the gills are fairly widely separated. Second, there appears to be a grayish tinge to the gills. Also the central depressions seen in some of the caps is not typical for L. decastes. Aside from the growth habit --terrestrial clusters-- and white spore print, L. descatses is known as a rather variable mushroom. Some sources believe this type represents a species complex... a group of closely-related species.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Guidelines | We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.