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panaeolus semiovatus?


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I have no intention of consuming these, at all.  I've been trying to identify what's coming up in the gardens.  The photos are of specimens I collected yesterday afternoon, they're getting dry and shrively now.  There are more growing in the garden, these were just the biggest ones I took for ID.  If need be I can take photos of fresh ones, too!

I found what looks like "egg head" mottlegills growing in my heavily manure-fertilized (mostly rabbit and pig manure) grow beds.  It fits the non-microscopic description of the species in Paul Stamet's Psilocybin Mushrooms of the World, EXCEPT that the interior of the stipe on all specimens collected was juicy, brown, with a tiny hollow hole down the length of the stipe.  The stipes were not fragile, but snapped cleanly when bent.  His description as follows: "Equally to slightly enlarged at the base; solid becoming tubular, and stuffed with a fibrous whitish pith.".  

I'm not a "try to make it fit" person with identification.   The mushrooms look nigh identical to species images, including those from the book.  I'm curious if there are sub species/relatives of this mushroom that might explain its juicy brown interior?  Maybe it's something entirely different?

 

Spores are black.   Cap is slightly moist/shiny and broadly dimple-textured.  Like, the surface is slightly wavy all around.  They are a buff color when fresh, darkening somewhat near the center.  The stipes were more of a beige/buff color when fresh.  Caps remain egg shaped in both young and old specimens.  Stipes pop out of the cap with a tug, like a socketed joint, versus being fibrously attached to the cap.  Gills are attached to the stipe though, you can see evidence of torn gills at the top of the removed stipes.  Bottom of the stipe is bulbous and smooth. Smells fresh and mushroomy.  Nice sturdy, crisp mushroom.  No staining observed with bruising.

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Did you notice if any of these had a ring on the stalk? Or any other indication of a partial veil?  Online sources indicate Panaeolus semiovatus var. phalaenarum is very similar to P. semiovatus with the difference being that it lacks a ring. From what I have found online about var. phalaenarum, it seems this variety has a partial veil but the veil fails to form a ring. (This actually seems to me to be rather flimsy evidence for designating phalaenarum as a variety.) The enlarged stipe bases seen here seem like a good indicator for P. semiovatus, and I presume that this trait is also associated with var. phalaenarum. Champignons du Quebec mentions that the stipe of semiovatus becomes hollow as the mushroom matures. Another trait of semiovatus mentioned by some sources is that the cap is slimy, at least for awhile after the mushroom first fruits. 

P. antillarum is similar, but completely lacks partial veil. Here's an interesting discussion found within a Mushroom Observer observation https://mushroomobserver.org/observer/show_observation/215347.  It appears that measuring spores may be required to confidently distinguish P. semiovatus var. phalaenarum from P. antillarum, if there is no evidence of partial veil. Other species of Panaeolus (sometimes) exhibiting the "egg shaped" cap appear to feature less substantial stipes. 

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Edit/Redo; I just harvested a few more and figured I'd edit this one instead of posting a new comment.  I felt pretty confident in my memory of the first mushrooms having a ring.  But the ones out there today do not.  And the first ones don't in the photos I took.  Hm.  

So what's out there is looking old, except this huge one that was growing alone in the same bed about 3 feet away. It's just a baby, probably would've made a hefty mushroom!  Other than it's comparatively freakish size, it's got all the features the first ones have.  And it has a white center!  Not a nice clean break of the stipe like the older ones.  It's fibrous and didn't want to break in half but was white inside.  The older ones were brown inside.  

Here are photos of the ones I just plucked.  You can better see their wet caps and waving texture.

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Edited by Pinecones
spoke too soon
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Reading on p. antillarum, same reference; "[Cap color] whitish to greyish at first, soon darkening to mottled blackish." < Definitely no grey or black in the patch.  "[Stipe] equal to slightly enlarged, and curved at the base, solid, and somewhat twisted." < not really solid or twisted in what I've dissected.  

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The robust button seen in the photo --along with the two with thinner stalks-- appears to show evidence of partial veil. The very narrow space between the edge of the cap and the stalk appears to show material weakly connecting the margin to the stalk. The photo showing the view into the removed cap also shows what appears to be remains of a partial veil lining the the cap margin. But, the veil on this immature button does not look like it is substantial enough to form a ring. So, I think these represent P. semiovatus var. phalaenarum. 

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And more often than not, challenging. If these are P. semiovatus var. phalaenarum, then according to some sources, this may be an unusual find as far north as MT. Has there been a recent warm spell? 

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We're in zone 3, but these are in a greenhouse that only freezes when it's single digits out. ¬†The grow beds are amended heavily with rabbit and pig manure. ¬†We recently were hitting 50-60¬ļf, and the greenhouses can get over 80¬ļf in direct sun.¬†¬†Though we woke up to an inch of snow today. ¬†Winter had to have one last hurrah.

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  • 2 years later...

What are these please %? Iv looked through a book and google but never quite identified them. Found growing in horse manure few sheep in there aswell but in the corner was a huge pile of sh xx t with these growing so any help would be appreciated 

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Thank you.  Glad I joined this site. That’s the name I seen on google but double check triple check always be sure to ID   Not dying from a mushroom. At my funeral people saying.  I knew this would happen haha. So to with them. 

Thank you.  Glad I joined this site. That’s the name I seen on google but double check triple check always be sure to ID   Not dying from a mushroom. At my funeral people saying.  I knew this would happen haha. So to with them. 

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I think the same sore of discussion that began this thread (initiated by Pinecones) applies to the photos posted by alangoldie37. Given the habitat and the appearance of the mushrooms (especially what appear to be black gills) I'd say they likely represent a species of Panaeolus. The bases of the stalks are quite thick (almost bulbous). This points away from several species of Panaeolus, but one species --Panaeolus antillarum-- is said to sometimes have  broadened base. From Mycoquebec, "...equal to slightly broadened at base and apex, sometimes distinctly broadened at base and shortly rooted..." P. antillarum is also described as "lacking pigment", meaning the mushrooms are usually white (except for the gills). The ones in the photo (alan's) appear to be grayish, although this may be a function of the ambient lighting. Were these observed growing indoors, where the temperature was perhaps warmer than outdoors? Panaeolus are typically found during the warm/hot months. Arriving at a confident species ID requires more information than is seen here. 

Here's the description of P. antillarum seen on Mycoquebec https://www.mycoquebec.org/bas.php?trie=P&l=l&nom=Panaeolus antillarum / Panéole des Antilles*&tag=Panaeolus antillarum&gro=160 . If you right click on the text, then you may be able to translate. 

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