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theplanets

tricholoma terreum (grey knight)??

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These look suspiciously like tricholoma terreum. Matches the descriptions from most of the reference sites I visited. Found these under some young white and red pines in a nearby trail. There were tones of them! They were hiding under pine needles when I found them. Some were in clusters, others were sprouting up on their own.

SIze: ranges from a few cm to over 10cm.

Cap: conical shaped when young. Grows to flat and flared on mature ones. Grey coloured (like a mouse). Lighter colour on the outer rim.

Stem:White smooth stem. Fibrous make up (similar texture to the Shaggy Mane stem). Even girth throughout. Slightly hallow in the centre. Strongly attached to cap.

Underside: Large White Gills, similar to that of the Elm Oyster

Smell: No strong smell (mushroom smell).

Taste: No distinct taste (spit out after).

Spore: White

Some pics are of some weird deformed mushrooms that seem to be symbiotic with this mushroom.

Any identification help can be greatly appreciate it!

Dave, can you help? I see that you have found some tricholoma terreum and posted on Mushroom Observer.

Hidden under pine needles

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Mature big mushrooms

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They were everywhere

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A cluster

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Underside of a big one

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You can see the Mychorrhizal from the root. This one has lots more mushrooms ready to bloom.

post-369-0-20908900-1351219807_thumb.jpeg

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Gray/grayish Tricholomas can be difficult to pinpoint. T. myomyces is sometimes treated as a synonym for T. terreum. I believe that the question of whether these two types actually represent different species is still being sorted out. Planets, you may want to check Tricholoma virgatum for your collections. The relatively large size and the central umbo (hump) on the cap (seen on a few of these) leads me toward this species name.

Except for T. portentosum --which is uncommon in my area-- I have not tried eating any of these gray Trichs.

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It doesn't fully fit the description for T. virgatum. And although visually fits, it doesn't have the smell described as T. myomyces. Not sure really. T. Terreum only grows in Europe aparently. How were you sure the one you found was T. terreum?

And also, any idea what that white puffy growth is?

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No idea about the white puffy growth.

Actually, I'm not certain about any of my T. terreum IDs, because T. terreum and T. myomyces are so similar... if these are truly distinct species. Until this is straightened out by the experts, I call all of these type mushrooms "Tricholoma terreum group." T. virgatum has an acrid/bitter taste.

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Some site described T. Terreum being found in Australia in newly planted pines. The area I found these in was a patch of planted pine. It had no distinct taste.

It'll be raining for 4 days. I'll go and see if they are still there after the rain stops.

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Some mushroom species from Austrailia, Asia, or even North America west of the Rockies tend to look different than types which may go by the same names in NA east of the Rockies. Also, mushrooms that look similar but come from two different major regions may actually be different species. Sometimes, the difference may be purely academic... virtually identical mushrooms with significantly different DNA signatures. But the main point is... take with a grain of salt information about mushroom ID relevant to mushrooms which are found in a major region different from your region. There are plenty of exceptions, though. Shaggy Manes (Coprinus comatus), for instance, look the same wherever they are found... as far as I know!

Most of the gray Trichs are found under various types of pines. There are some grayish-brown to brown types that are found under either conifers or hardwoods. This is a problematic group... the grayish to brownish ones. Some of these types are serious sickeners. T. pardinum is listed as poisonous. T. virgatum is suspected as problematic. I do know that at least one of the T. terreum types is collected for the table in Canada. I have heard this in internet discussions. I recommend that, if you want to learn the edible type(s) available in your locale, then find someone in your area who hunts them for the table. Procede with caution. Some types of mushrooms are easier to learn than others.

Is there a mushroom club in your area, Planets?

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Two of our MOMS members (who live part of the time in France) found what they thought were T. terreum here in southeast Missouri. They were not very large, caps max about 1 1/2 inches. I didn't take any photos, but they looked very much like these.

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Dave, yes, there's the mycology society of Toronto, who are very active. I think some members of this forum are also members there. I'm thinking about joining, as soon as I have some free time. :)

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Ok guys, I'll have to report that I did eat a small sample of this mushroom. They are prolific in my area right now, pretty much under most mature groups of red or white pine. I boiled a small fresh sample and ate half of the cap. The taste is very light, almost nondescript. Texture is like an oyster but no taste. It's been 4 hours with no reaction so I think I am safe.

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And also, any idea what that white puffy growth is?

Could that "white puffy growth" be Aborted Entoloma (Entoloma abortivum)? This one is easy to identify (the aborted forms) and yummy.

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theplanets, they said they did not eat them, since they found them here & were not sure if they were the same as those they found in France. Probably a good idea.

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Thanks for asking FB. I did eat a half a cap amount of it and happy to report that I'm still alive! :)

No noticeable adverse effects at all after consumption. The mushroom was kind of tasteless though, not sure if the parboiling, or the freshness of the mushroom has anything to do with it. I may try to eat it again if i come across a better specimen.

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By the way for those interested, I came across Tricholomas of North America by By Alan E. Bessette, Arleen R. Bessette, William C. Roody, Steven A. Trudell

- See more at: http://utpress.utexas.edu/index.php/books/bestri#sthash.vCbiZ05L.dpuf

According to the identification key, T. terreum fits the description.

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I have to agree with Calvert. The puffy growths look similar to aborted entoloma. I have seen these, at this time of year, several times. Quite often preceding the appearance of honey mushrooms. However in most cases there have been fully formed entoloma associated with the aborted stage, this I don't see in your pics. May not be a bad idea to check this area in a couple weeks for honeys. Under no circumstance would I say these are aborted entoloma, they just appear similar.

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Honey mushrooms fruit on wood (dead or alive) and they dont much seem to care if they are hardwoods or conifers. They will aggressively extend their mycellium underground although Im not sure if they need to do that along roots or if they will just make a run for it through soil. I suspect the latter. The abortive entoloma thingy happens when the honey mushroom mycellium attacks an entoloma perhaps as the entoloma is starting to fruit and causes the entoloma to form a white thingy that looks remarkably like the white thingy in your photo. The entoloma that gets attacked is in fact grey but I have never seen one that grows anywhere close to the size of what you are calling a Tricholoma. Generally I will have to look hard to find one of the entolomas that has not been aborted in among the aborted forms. It looks like one of two things is happening here. There could be an entoloma fruiting that is being attacked by honeys in among the Trichs (and perhaps even some of the small grey mushrooms you see are entoloms. Or the honeys could be attacking the Trichs and forming a similar sort of white thingy. If that were happening to Trichs I bet it would be of real interest to mycologists. I missed this thread first time around but if you find this happening again I can put you in touch with some folks with microscopes who might want a closer look.

I dont eat Tricholoma of any type. I find them quite difficult to identify with any sort of certainty and some of them have a fairly horrible reputation. The most frequently eaten Tricholoma in Ontario would be T. equestre and these are consumed by the millions here. Interestingly T. equestre has been associated with multiple deaths in Europe. No ne seems quite sure is out T. equestre is actually the same mushrooms that is eaten by the millions in Europe but sometimes kills folks or if it just looks the same but I figure Im not out foraging because Im starving so I dont really have a need to take a risk and I just leave them alone. One day for fun I brought home a handful taken from a 5 gallon pail that had been collected by a Polish family. They werent entirely certain what the name of this mushroom was but they were certain it made great pickled mushrooms and they had been eating them for decades. I attempted to key them out from scratch from 3 books but when I was done the closest I could come was a choice between T. equestre and a look alike that was considered poison. I decided then that if that was as close as I could come I wasnt going to eat the things even if it eventually turned out that our equestre was safe. But I also admit that I dont consider anything you have to boil 3 times so it doesnt kill you to be food.

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Here's how I arrived at the ID. From the ID key of Tricholomas of North America. #18 (see pic below). As you can see, T. terreum and T. myomyces are very alike indeed, right down to the last key. I personally did not observe any sort of cortina from all the specimens in all stages of growth.

Will try to find more this October and capture more info to tighten the ID.

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The existence of a cortina as an ID feature separating T. terreum from T. myomyces is a point of contention among mycologists. Some believe there is only one species, and a given mushroom may or may not exhibit a fleeting cortina.

There's also T. virgatum, another widely distributed gray trich. This one usuually has a bitter/acrid taste.

T. nigrum is a rare not-well-understood gray-capped species.

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